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Posts Tagged ‘Christianity’

There’s a special occasion today, and for one day, I’m going to open up a bit about what it is I/we do…read on.

I have known, for years now, that my husband is amazing.   I have even blogged about it on a few occasions.  The times that I find myself thinking what a great husband and man he is are far more than the times I question his actions or intentions.  I’m not trying to imply that he’s perfect, as we all have our moments, but more often than not, to me, he is.

I don’t discuss business on here, but for those that don’t know, we work together from home.  It’s been a lifesaver when children are sick, or there are school functions, or when you just don’t feel like going to “work.”  For us it has blessed our marriage by allowing us to truly get to know each other and bond.  That bond translates to better parenting, better family ties, us being happier, and has allowed us to make a stronger team against outside forces.  We all face stress, trials, and attacks from the outside world and un-Godly forces, and the ability to be confident in your partner and know you have someone that has your back is the best gift you can give yourself and your spouse.  We often get questions ranging from “how do you spend ALL DAY together” to “do you really enjoy being around each other that much?”  The answer is the same from either of us…yes, most certainly.   My business partner respects me, backs me up with tough clients, steps in when I’ve had enough of someone, and is amazing in his work ethic and ability to land clients.   There is no one I’d rather spend all day with.

So, with that preface, I’m proud to announce that D has become a weekly blogger on a Christian website!  I am proud of him for being a provider and I’m proud that others view him as the strong business man, and man of God he is.  You will quickly see, in his writing, that he has a gift for words and conveying a message that hits home.  Please share it as we want him to have the opportunity to be a blessing to as many people as we can reach.  There is always the possibility that there are business minded people that want information, and if it’s presented in a Christlike manner two efforts can be accomplished in one manner.  The Christian Work At Home Ministries site is a great tool for learning about building business, working from home, and glorifying God in our lives.

So, with that introduction, please check him out at the link below, and be sure to follow us on Facebook and check back weekly at either link for his business blog entries!

Love those eyes…Oh, sorry. Serious marketing pic here.

Click here for his first post – What brought me home!

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So guess what, I’m tired of it too, and this guy disagrees with me…but he’s right, and you should read it. All of it, even if you cringe at first.

http://www.owldolatrous.com/?p=288

Over the past week, I have eaten at CFA (and before), it’s not because I hate gay people, or because I want to “win” and prove that Christians have rights too, and it’s certainly not because they are healthy.  No one is winning here, and since I don’t personally have a dog in the fight, and would only be eating at CFA because they are “Christian” from now on, I see (from his words) that it’s not ok.

Whether it’s CFA’s doing, or the “Christian public” – this whole thing has been handled horribly by anyone wanting to stand up and show the world what Christians believe in and what we will rally for.  We rally for chicken?  We rally to show those gays that they are WRONG and we will put all our money into heart clogging food to prove that point?  We encourage a company that twice removes itself (from direct donation) so they can continue to say they aren’t discriminatory and homophobic?  I am not homophobic, I am also not discriminatory. CFA in it’s stores is also not discriminatory, however, as I’ve been told (that is the main argument from the “other side”) – they spend their well earned sandwich money on other organizations that clearly and proudly discriminate and even go further than that.

Is this you this week?

As a Christian, no, I don’t believe that marriage is defined by opposite sex partners, but I have that right.  That will not change, it’s my belief based on my own research and my own upbringing.  I also know for a fact that many of the “Christians” in major support of CFA would not be loving or nurturing or open to an openly gay couple that walked into their church.  I know first hand how judgemental Christians are.  Try being 16 and pregnant in a private school.  However, my beliefs are not what’s up for debate here and I really don’t care if you like my view or not.  However, I can change the way that those I do not agree with view my beliefs and my way of upholding them.

I said yesterday, that I can completely see the “other view” – there are lines around the building in every city, for chicken…where are the lines for the homeless shelters?  Where are the lines for the hospitals to hold babies addicted to drugs, or hold the hand of a person going through chemo?  Where are the Christians who want to make a real difference?  They’re in line for a sandwich.

Through none of this, would I, if I were gay or a non-Christian, feel loved, and ministered to.  I would not feel like going to church, or reaching out to anyone that is supporting CFA  or spouting “we’re winning” or that CFA is tops.   Ask yourself this, my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ…at what point, if you were not a Christian, would you stop one of these Christians standing in line, posting pictures or shaking their fists up in victory to ask “why is it you are so happy and your life is wonderful and you have this spark?” I have not seen any Christian spark, not in myself and not in others that are so adamant about supporting CFA.  I have not seen the “light” that we are to shine among men.   I would do exactly as they have done, and fight back because they feel attacked.  Christians were not attacked, at any point in this, until we stood up to support CFA. Dan Cathy didn’t even attack, he stated what most of us Christians agree with and also believe, however he swept under the rug the part that is really making the “other side” upset.  The donations.  I’ve researched, the claims are correct, the organizations that CFA supports (indirectly down the line) are very discriminatory and even predatory on the gay community, and others that don’t agree with them.

It’s being touted that CFA stands up for “family values” – so does that mean your Christian family wants to eat unhealthy, and fall in with the crowd (as Christians we are called to be different and stand for what is right in the face of wrong). To me, wrong is pushing anyone further away from God. Does your family value pictures stating “we won” (over chicken) or do you want the non-Christian public to view you exactly like they view Westboro?  That is not what I want to support, nor how I want to bring others to Christ.

What I also will not be supporting is openly pro-gay companies that I disagree with.  Again, that is my choice, where I put my money.  There are tons of companies that I’m sure support things I do not agree with, as long as they aren’t singing it from the rooftops and I need their products, then not just me, but all of us are going to have to use them.  However, we should be aware that at any time, we may have to stop supporting them if they stand up and we disagree.

It is OUR duty as Christians to be a good example and love those that are not like us, and that aren’t our brothers and sisters in Christ.  Does it say we are to love only those that are receptive and take on our views?  NO.  As I’ve heard and seen on facebook, don’t judge others because they sin differently than you do.

Matthew 5:16 ESV

In the same way, let your light shine before others, so that they may see your good works and give glory to your Father who is in heaven.

1 Peter 3:15 ESV

But in your hearts honor Christ the Lord as holy, always being prepared to make a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you; yet do it with gentleness and respect,

Philippians 2:1-4 ESV

So if there is any encouragement in Christ, any comfort from love, any participation in the Spirit, any affection and sympathy, complete my joy by being of the same mind, having the same love, being in full accord and of one mind. Do nothing from rivalry or conceit, but in humility count others more significant than yourselves. Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others. Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus, ...

Did you read that last verse?  Read it again…and tell me…as a Christian, this past week, have you looked to the interest of others or your own?  As a Christian, I do not support gay marriage.  I support gay unions, and gay people, and I have no issues with them, they are part of my family, and I have been close friends for years with some very openly gay couples.  My beliefs have not changed, however my willingness to support the discrimination and vilifying of my friends and family has.

~ Mel

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Another Father’s Day and an opportunity to appreciate those that have raised us, loved us and provided for us, and continue to do so.  I am thankful to have some amazing men in my life, all with their own ways of loving the children they are fathers to.

My son is young, he (much like me) got a jump on parenting and began in his late teens.  I don’t think for a minute that he was ready or had a clue how much stress and love would be involved in having children at any age, much less as a teenager.  You always try to prepare your kids for things you’ve been through, and pray that they heed the warning that it was hard, or it sucked at times.  Even with those descriptions, they know the love you have for them and have shown them through those times, and that they made it through all your bad parenting decisions, and they don’t see it as such a bad thing.  I don’t view any of being a teenage parent as a “mistake” – it’s simply something beautiful done at the wrong time for most people.  We aren’t ready at that age, we don’t know everything we should, and we have no desire to listen to those that do know what we should do.  We are still children ourselves.  Through that, I raised an amazing son, and my amazing son, is raising his sons with the same love and trial and error I did.  He has learned a lot in the 2 years he has been a daddy, and as he makes choices and learns the consequences of them, he is learning that I was right…it’s not easy, but it is totally worth it.  It’s hard to watch him flounder and do things totally different than I would, just as I’m sure it was for my mom, but I am very proud of him, and the choice he has made to stand up and take responsibility for the children God has placed in his life.

I’ve never had a father in law like D’s dad.  It was a bit scary coming into a family with a preacher as your new father in law.  While we were dating, D’s parents came to Georgia while D stayed in North Carolina for work.  I vaguely remembered them from around school and church when we were little, but past that, there was no relationship and I had no idea “how” they were.  D assured me that they would love me, but I was still so scared to have them come visit me without him present.  So nervous, that before they came to visit, I changed my blue nail polish because I didn’t want his mother to think anything odd of me.  I had enough to offer without blue nails though…let’s see, 2 divorces – check, teenage son with a kid on the way – check, making his son drive 2 states away to date me – check…yeah, not good.  Except, it was.  In fact, I’ve learned from the entire family, that there is nothing that surprises them or takes them out of their comfort zone.  No family is perfect, and my imperfect background was nothing of consequence to him (or them).  His only requirement and concern about me was that I love Jesus and am a Christian, and that I love his son unconditionally and without reservation.  I am proud to be a part of his family and even more thankful that my husband had such a strong example of what a man is to teach him how to love and protect me, and how to love and raise our children.

My dad and I have something different than most people.  I don’t remember lots of the details of when my parents divorced.  I know things now that my mom has told me, or my sister, or that my dad has eluded to that he is not proud of having done.  I still don’t have a clear bone to pick with him since I didn’t have those feelings of anger/betrayal at the time things occurred.  I have held resentment for what he put my mother, my sister and me through later in life because of his decisions, and for not sticking to his pledge to love, honor, and cherish my mom.  However, we all make mistakes, sometimes they are small and just annoying bumps in the road, and sometimes they will forever effect our lives and the lives of those around us.  I can’t say that I’ve forgotten all the things I know about what happened, but I do forgive him, and now that he is willing to know about me and my life and I am witnessing him make an effort to be involved and talk to me, I find it much easier to have conversations with him without feeling like it’s just a formality.  My dad has had health issues lately, and after losing my mom, I don’t want to lose him and regret not being adult enough to move past any hurt feelings I have in order to show him love that we all deserve.  He is not perfect, but he made four amazing daughters who love him more than he probably realizes.

Last year on Father’s Day I talked about how amazing D is.  As the father figure in our children’s daily lives, he consistently loves, raises, cares for and does everything in his power to ensure that the children we have are aware of his love, and the expectations of them on their behavior and actions while learning and growing up.  It’s pretty hard to be a father to a child that chooses to walk a path that is not in line with how a child should be raised, but even through that hardship he has taken on 2 children that are not his biologically and treated them as his own.  He is under no requirement to be a parent to my children, however he does it happily, with grace and strength, and with God’s love and guidance on a daily basis.   It has allowed them to bloom, grow and learn to be comfortable with the man they have in their daily lives by trusting him, and knowing that he loves them when they are wrong and loves them when they are right.  There is nothing more special to a mother than having a man, that treats their children as they should be treated.  My life is much easier, smoother, and happier having a man that loves his family as selflessly as he does.

Happy Father’s Day to you all, you are all greatly and deeply loved!

What Makes A Dad

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It’s late, and quiet.  D is sleeping, YAY!  He’s been dealing with insomnia, so we are thankful when he sleeps at night.  Yeah, I know you don’t care…let’s move along.

I started 2 other posts tonight, one on Entitlement and one on Change.  Neither of them flowed out, and from experience that means I have tons to say…it’ll come when it’s ready.   I also wanted to start writing more about gratitude and being thankful for things in my life.  This blog will never be updated daily, I think that’s boring, I don’t even want to know what happens with me every day, so I’m sure you have better things to do.  I can feel that I have lots going through my head and need to get some of it out, let’s see where this goes.

Seems lately that I’ve been involved in more than one “heated” debate about a few things.  Girl Scouts, fathers shooting up laptops, Planned Parenthood, Susan G Komen, breastfeeding, Whitney Houston and the flag, Obama,  and gay rights to name a few.  I’m NOT getting into that here, and if you try to hijack my post I’ll delete your comment…I don’t really care what your thoughts are about any of that, so there.  I’ve realized through those conversations, mainly on FB, that people often forget their manners and basic home training when they realize someone doesn’t agree with them, and *GASP* they aren’t listening to their side or better, changing their minds.  It amazes me how full of themselves people are, there is a difference in standing up for your beliefs or a cause and being a pushy, childish idiot.  I actually unfriended 2 people, and was unfriended by 3 people over more than one conversation in the last few months…actual friends, not FB friends.

I find nothing wrong with stating your side, arguing your side, believing in whatever you believe in.  In fact, if you don’t stand up for what you think is right, then what’s the point?  I don’t want to be your friend if you have no opinion on anything.  For real.  I enjoy a good debate/talk/discussion about anything.  What I don’t enjoy is people attacking others for a random statement, or when you’ve stated your side and I’ve stated mine and I don’t succumb to your views.   What kind of world would this be if we all agreed on everything?  Boring.  Even in the home D and I don’t agree on stuff, hell we don’t agree on how to load the dishwasher, or what temperature to keep the thermostat at.  You can ask him…I love to discuss how wrong his way is, and I know full and well I’m not changing his mind on it, but I have to state my case.  I don’t expect to change anyone’s mind…but once you are informed of both sides, yours and the opposing one, and I have given reasons, and support for my views, the ball is in your court on what to do with the information.  Does it not occur to people that if you wouldn’t change your mind to agree with me, then no amount of your disagreeing with me is going to change mine?

Judge not, lest ye do it correctly.

That goes twice for my religious beliefs.  The morals/beliefs/Biblical principles I was raised to believe and choose to believe as an adult trump your argument that you are a good person.  Being a good person is not a principle, it’s a characteristic we should all possess, and as harsh as it sounds, no, that alone won’t get you into heaven.  Not my rules…don’t whine to me.   I’m tired of people using the counter that religious beliefs are unfair, or against our commandment to love one another and judge not.  We are to love the person, not the offense, and there are times when you are allowed to judge – study your Bible.  Why is it that non-Christians can’t just present the information needed and then hush?  I wonder why you so vehemently have to defend your views if you feel they are right, can’t you just sit back and know you are right?  I make it a point to not argue, but to find backup for whatever I’m stating.  If that means you keep disagreeing with what is said, then have fun with that, I’m not God…I don’t have to deal with you after I’ve done my part.   To inform someone on a topic where there is a Biblical disagreement (or someone that doesn’t acknowledge the Bible) is different than presenting information on something you are passionate about.  Passion is not commanded in the Bible, a non-Christian can just sit back and think they are right all day long and you won’t go to hell any faster than if you argued about your side all day long.  However, for someone that is religious/following God’s commandments, we are to spread the word and share it with those that are lost.  One problem is that in our society too many people think that doing good is enough, they don’t feel lost.  My view is that if you are supporting things that are against God, then you aren’t informed of what He said.  If you are informed and not following what He said, then I have even MORE of a duty to help you see the light since you have chosen to ignore it.  I can’t sit back and go “eh, let him be wrong…no biggie.”  You may not understand the difference, but when you are a Christian there is a huge difference in what you can and cannot ignore.  Being a Christian does not afford me the luxury of being silent while others sail along their own river of demise.

My goals for getting involved in the topics on FB were to be informative, have conversation and because I like to be heard (shocker).   I TRY to use articles, proof, facts or anything that backs up my view when involved in a heated discussion.  It seems though, that others like to just get involved to disagree, and try to strong arm others, or belittle them when there is a minority present and they have backup.  I’m always amazed at the things people throw out there with no proof or backup and then further stunned when they act offended when you ask for the basis of their statement.   Does no one know that we aren’t all idiots and don’t just accept what we are told?   When did it become ok to just take things as truth?

I’m really not surprised by much anymore on FB (or in life), it’s almost daily that someone posts some annoying picture on FB or via email about a warning or “support” whatever by reposting this hurt child/dog/military/medical/gang initiation picture.  Can you tell how much that stuff bothers me?  Why is it that people that know they are sending information out just hit “share” without checking the validity or using common sense before further spreading things that are old, false, or just plain do NOTHING to show your support for XYZ cause?  Want to show support for battered women?  Go volunteer at a shelter.  Want to support the troops?  Write letters, send care packages, say thank you.  Want to support equal rights?  Vote, go volunteer at the organization of your choice.  STOP re-posting pictures and thinking you’re actually doing something good.  The problem with FB and email forwards is that it gives people a false sense of doing something…and then no one is doing anything.  Oh, I posted this picture of a flight attendant with a feel good story about some old mean white lady complaining about an Indian man on her flight…so I’m not a racist and I’m a good person.  No you aren’t, you didn’t check to see that that story was FAKE, has been circulating for years, and just gets changed depending on what flavor of the year is on our radar as the “unwanted” race.  Don’t give me that crap about how “it’s a good moral, who cares if it’s real or not?”  I DO, and so do most people.  What about the moral of getting off your butt and actually supporting something?

I’ll hush on that front, I think you get the point.  Don’t share stuff if you didn’t see it, and you didn’t research it to find out if it’s real.  We aren’t going to stop for a baby seat on the side of the road, we were warned of that via email 8 years ago.  I promise not to go around licking the tops of cans because someone may have laced them with cocaine…I learned my lesson the summer of ’02.  If Apple/Coke/Microsoft/FB is going to start charging, or will give me a free anything for sharing or clicking, they need a better AP/AR department, because they’ve been saying they were going to do that for years now.  Hang on, I have to give this Nigerian man my routing number…Blessings to you too.

Oh, I got off topic.  Not sorry.  It just seems that we have lost common sense.  We have forgotten that social media is just that, social.

so·cial [soh-shuhl]

adjective

1.pertaining to, devoted to, or characterized by friendly companionship or relations: a social club.
2.seeking or enjoying the companionship of others; friendly; sociable; gregarious.
3.of, pertaining to, connected with, or suited to polite or fashionable society: a social event.

4. living or disposed to live in companionship with others or in a community, rather than in isolation:

Yes, you can stand up for what you believe in, you can support a cause, you can share your likes and dislikes, and you can be whatever religion you want to be.  You should refrain from pissing people off, ruining your friendships, or being overall douchy when someone doesn’t believe what you do.  If you’re going to do those things, then you’ll quickly find yourself in need of more friends and no one to be social with.

I blog better with tunes…tonight’s awesome playlist courtesy of SiruisXM 90’s on 9 and The Pulse:
Des’ree – You Gotta Be
Poison – Something to Believe In
Tupac – California Love
The Offspring – Pretty Fly (for a white guy) – why does he say 5 two times?
Train – Hey Soul Sister
Greenday – Basket Case
Len – Steal my Sunshine
Billy Idol – Cradle of Love
The Fugees – Killing me Softly (with his song) – 2 times
En Vogue – Free Your Mind
Matchbox 20 –  3 am

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Because I want to write more…my “draft” section holds nine, half written, barely started posts.  So I’ve decided to blog about things I like to talk about, my marriage to D and something new I have wanted to try, a gratitude journal.

Whether you are married already or researching vows to use in your wedding, you’ve heard the old standby lines:

I, ______ , take you, ______, to be my husband/wife, to have and to hold from this day forward; for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health, to love, cherish, (and obey,) till death us do part, according to God’s holy law.

Short of a few more personal “how I love thee” type statements and the ring exchange, that’s the gist of most vows.  Like most people, I don’t really ponder those vows on a daily basis, or even a weekly one.  Most of us think about what vows we want when planning a wedding, but once they are said, not much thought is given to them until you experience or are forced to live up to them.  Even then, many people fail to understand and even have the desire to stand by the words that are what binds us to each other as spouses.  These are the same words you longed to say to the person you chose to be with, the words that probably choked you up, brought a tear to your eyes, and the words that make your marriage your best bet to survive the good and bad of life.

I’m no saint here, I’ve said these vows more than once, the relevance and meaning at the time, for me, was no different.  I meant them, no matter who was standing next to me, when I said them.  Life, feelings, circumstances, and selfishness (you and your spouse) changes you, and lots of us don’t make it through that as graciously as we’d like to think we had.  The difference is what you learn and how you grow through those things.

Casting stones…

Big Daddy and I have almost been married for 2 years now (it has flown by, I can’t believe it), and through those 2 years we have experienced so many things that most people don’t ever have to deal with in a marriage.  Don’t get me wrong, it’s not all hardship, but the good times and loving family come at a price, and that price is  job changes, anxiety, insomnia, health problems, ex’s, teenagers, grandkids, in laws, children with absent parents, being forced to be an absent parent, depression, normal growing pains of a new marriage, hurt feelings and overall tough times.

For us, it’s the harder parts of the vows have shaped our marriage into what it is, and what we wanted it to be.   We are by no means rich, yet we have all we need.  Shelter, food, medicines, entertainment, animals that we love (and love us), family, friends and a home.  I wouldn’t say we are living the poorer – we are in the middle, but if you ask D we have been close a few times.  He can’t stand to have a hard day/week with the bank account, and I have to remind him that “it’s been one day that we have a small balance…we get paid Friday.”  He’s pretty funny sometimes about it, yet I am totally comfortable and happy knowing that just because we may not have money one week, we’ll be back on track next week.  It’s also amazing to not feel the strain of fighting over money.  Whether we have it or not, doesn’t change how we treat each other, it’s never been an issue.

D’s health led us to him working from home with me, not a bad trade in my book.  We have been together 24/7 for almost 1.5 years now.  Yes 24/7.  Both of us have been told and heard “I couldn’t do that, how do you do that?” (I’m on FB chatting with a friend who just said “So you’re both home together all the time. Sounds terrifying to me”) We do it because it works, because it’s comfortable, and because why would you marry someone you didn’t want to be with all the time?  When the kids are gone, when the power is out, when you’re sick, when you’re bitchy, when you’re lonely, mad, upset, when you’ve been anything other than “OK” who else do you want to be there with you?  I want him.

It’s not just D’s health that troubles us at times.  We both have our share of insomnia, anxious moments, migraines, moods, and life in general.  Through all of these things we have learned more about how to lean on one another, care for one another, love one another, trust one another, and it has only served to strengthen our bond, which carries throughout every aspect of problem solving for us.

Coming to this marriage both divorced and both with children from previous marriages was something we both signed up for, but really, you can’t prepare for something like that.  While dating we talked it out, we tried to prepare each other, and yet, the real thing is more annoying, trying, and hard to gracefully saunter through than one would hope.  Yet through it all, neither of us has turned on the other because of a situation with an ex or the parent of one of our children.  We are now and eternally, on each others side.  If that were not the case, the court, jealous ex’s, custody, lies, “secrets,” ex’s that feel they know things your spouse doesn’t, and games in general would easily shoot down any shaky relationship or one that didn’t mean those vows.

Neither of us has experienced the level of love and security we have now.  With us both being mid 30’s and having multiple marriages, that is a sad, yet accurate picture of many marriages and relationships out there.   Not only should you mean what you say, but you should be sure that the person you are choosing to say it to means it also.  There is no reason to enter into something as serious as marriage knowing that the feelings and promises do not hold as much truth to your other half as they do you.

We have made a choice not to make our marriage harder than it has to be.  With so many outside influences and “drama” already being thrown at us, we had a choice to make.  I am proud and thankful that we have chosen to enjoy each other and to have the marriage we’ve always wanted regardless of what comes our way.

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Well, we all know I love talking about marriage, and submission/love.  It’s not that I dwell on it, but it always interests me to hear how other women view it.  There are so many women out there, married, single, Christian, non-Christian, happy, sad, all kinds that all have questions or have different variations on what they believe and practice when it comes to marriage vows/commandments in the Bible.

I’ve posted many blogs on it, if you haven’t read them here’s the links:
Husbands love your wives (more than just a little)
Submission…when he’s lovin’ you better be submittin’

This is what I think most women that don’t agree with submission view it as. Truth is, it’s much more than that.

Last time I posted a blog about it this conversation ensued on my FB page.  I’ve changed our real names, but it was with a friend who decidedly disagrees with me, at least that’s what I thought at first.  In the end, I realized that she’s been hurt before, and like most women, has changed her mind about how a marriage should work.  I am ever grateful that she opened up and allowed me to ask her some questions to further understand her.

  • HERE WE GO! (It is edited for names, irrelevant content and length – yes, it was longer)
    • MM I read your blog. I don’t disagree with what you are saying… but I don’t agree either. It could be that I was raised by hippies…. it could be that I have HUGE feminist viewpoints, or it could be that I’m just one big ol’ control freak. I’ve always felt that any partnership is equal.. with both parties pitching in, in all areas of the relationship. I truly don’t think I would ever be able to let go and just let someone lead me.
    • Mel Our marriage is very equal – ask Big Daddy. I think most non-Christians feel like you do. I don’t even know if you are a Christian…I’m just going with what I hear(in your words)! As always, everything doesn’t work for everyone!
    • J What does Christian versus non-Christian have to do with it…did I miss something? And the term “Christian” is veryyyy subject to interpretation and some interpretations are quite interesting. I’m not arguing…I’m asking because I’m curious.
    • MM you make a good point J. I’m not trying to argue either… just found it very interesting. oh, and I’m a christian. 😉
    • J I’m not…but I promise I’m a long way from a heathen devil worshiper, too.
    • Big Daddy Equality and submission are more closely linked than most would think. The christian vs non-christian is more of a point of view of the situation in general. Following biblical doctrine is why Mel is submissive. So if you don’t follow the teachings of the bible, your view point is completely different than her’s.  I actually seek her council on most everything, so it isn’t like I am “Lord of My Domain.” When she is submissive to me and I am submissive to God, then she is submissive to God through me. Believe me I always have her best interest in mind. Part of being submissive to God is having the best interest of her and the kids before any of my wants or desires.
    • Mel Sorry, I’m not answering, I’m over here doing family tree! D can answer for me…not because he rules but because I’m busy:)  Or they could read the other post about your duty to God and me! https://justalittlemel.wordpress.com/2010/10/08/husbands-mine-especially-love-your-wives-not-just-a-little/Check that, his commandment is much harder in my view!
    • Mel J, I say Christian/non-Christian, because it’s normally a huge difference if you don’t believe as a Christian does. It’s not any reference to who is better, simply the belief system/chain of command of a marriage is different between the two.
    • MM Very interesting. I thank your husband for his input. 🙂
    • Big Daddy If you really look at it, I am submissive to my family and especially my wife. The word seems to have a bad connotation, but anytime you put someone before yourself you are being submissive to their wants, needs and desires. It’s what we do every day for the ones we love. It’s an exchange of respect.
    • Mel Not to mention, if you don’t want to read that other post…he has to love me…he’s commanded to. All the time, no matter what, even to the extent of making me happy and taken care of BEFORE himself. What’s not to like there? MM – I would love to ask you some things without offending you…just to hear your take – is that ok?
    • MM Absolutely! go for it, and… for the record… my responses are not to offend anyone. Just my opinions. 🙂
    • Mel YAY! OK. So most people I hear from on this topic are either:a) not Christian, which I think makes a huge difference on how you view the household chain of command (God, husband, wife, kids)
      b) men who just want their wives to shut up and listen
      or
      c) Christian and agree with me.You stated you are a Christian and don’t see how you could let go and let someone lead you. I’d like to know what vows you used, and without sounding mean, did those include “love, honor, obey” or anything with biblical reference in your vows or how did you come to agree to vows to use in your ceremony? I guess what I’m asking is, being Christian, do you choose not to believe those verses (mentioned in the blog) or what’s your take on that part of the Bible? What do YOU view submission as, and how do you view the alternate command that your husband “love your wives as Christ did the church.” Do you feel your husband should love you that much, in the way that Christ did – dying for our sins?That’s pretty much it, I would also like to add, that when I was single and a mom, working full time, and doing everything…I felt VERY much like you. I couldn’t imagine letting go of the reins – nothing would have gotten done. I can make decisions, I can call all the shots, I can multitask, and I always think my way is the best way, we are women…it’s just how we are. That has not faded a bit! Someone said that women shouldn’t be submissive because when and if the husband ever leaves or dies she will have no clue how to handle life. I’ve been divorced and had a husband die…both not fun, but unless you are remedial, you can handle life. I have willingly given things to D that I used to stress over, or hate doing, or not want to do that I had to do…and now, I get to relax and enjoy life and things that I couldn’t before because I have a partner and husband that handles things for me. It’s quite freeing to not HAVE to handle everything!
    • Mel Oooh girl…. I’m going to have to smoke first. 😉 give me a few minutes.
    • Mel LOL, I hope that didn’t come across bad, I am truly asking. Just as many people don’t see how I or anyone could “agree” to submit, I want to know different views.
    • MM Ok…. here we go!! 🙂 Well… when I was married (getting a divorce I asked for) our vows said “to love and honor.”  I specifically omitted “obey” for a reason. See… we were originally going to get married in a catholic church. However, we had to do this like 500 question test thingy. In this test, it had as one of the questions “the MAN will be the head of the household…. agree or disagree” I not only circled disagree a 1000 times, I put “not a chance in hell.”  Of course, that got flagged by the priest. He asked me why. I told him what I told you earlier. He said what you said earlier. I said that I feel it should be 2 people working together to accomplish one goal. He said you can’t do that without leadership… I agreed and said God will lead us and together we battle the decisions. We got a letter later that week telling us the priest refused to marry us b/c I needed to prove to him “on a constant and continuing basis” that I was a good catholic. Yeah… that didn’t go so well for me. I have a sailor’s mouth… but I digress.  In my opinion, the Bible is viewed differently by each person who reads it. Take for instance some of the Morman’s believe that polygamy is not only the right thing to do…but the ONLY way… and God’s way. While having another gal around the house to do the cleaning and laundry would rock… I couldn’t see my husband sleeping with another woman. EVER. I’m too jealous for that. So, to them, I’m not living the way of God.
    • Mel Again, just asking questions here, and if it’s not something you wanna answer say so, and D said to make sure you know I’m not questioning your “Christian-ness” at all. I’m asking what you believe. Also, if you’d rather answer NOT on here, I’d be fine talking in PM. Got it, was it THAT guy or just anyone in general you don’t feel is “qualified” to be the head besides you? Where does your belief that it’s ok NOT to agree with the man as the head come from? Meaning do you feel there is some biblical backup for what you believe?I agree with what you said, 2 people under God’s leadership – hence what I said about if I didn’t like how D handled something I have backup…he has to be in line with God, and if he’s not, I go to God, I can go OVER D’s head. I guess it comes down to what you feel you can handle as a couple, and what you are ok with, I’ve just never known a Christian woman that openly said she didn’t agree with the verses, so thank you for letting me ask:)  I totally love Sister Wives…we watch it every week and on Netflix. I see an issue with that though, where Kody has said that he thinks it’s sickening and vile to imagine one of his wives with multiple husbands…really? However, that is their belief system, I also don’t believe in the book of Mormon, so I don’t know what it says but I do know what the Bible says, and Catholic or Baptist (or whatever) we use the same Bible…that has the same verses, so I wanted to know the…um…justification for not agreeing with it on the submission part.
    • MMMy husband took me for granted.. practically ignored me and I spent 12 years of my life trying to make it work b/c I do (or did) not believe in divorce. I signed up for this deal. I prepared to share my life with someone forever. I spent 12 years feeling more alone in a marriage than I did when I was single. So… as hard as it was for me… I left him. Shortly after. I met a most amazing man. He loves me, my kids and we take amazing care of each other. I believe God put him in my path. Is our situation ideal? Hell no. Would have this been the path I chose for myself? Hell no. However… I feel because I didn’t just submit and resign myself to “this is my life” and submit to my husband… I was given a new lease on life. I feel as if I tried every avenue with my husband to make it work, to make us (or should I say myself) happy. I guess that’s how I feel about the submitting to your husband thing. I feel that doing so…. you can loose a part of yourself by working so hard to please someone else. I feel I lost a bit of ME by trying so very hard to get him to be pleased with me. (which… I’m a HUGE people pleaser by nature and that’s not always a good thing).

      Now that I’m with this new person… I “spoil” him as I call it. He’s treated like a king. And equally, I’m treated as a queen. However… if we were to ever get married, I’m positive we would do things as a team. I want as much input as he does. And no one gets the final say. Not that I don’t trust him. I feel that we are both walking down this path together and we can both show each other the flowers and amazing things that we each see from our sides of the road. I want to learn from him and vice versa. I don’t feel that can happen if one person has the final say… even if it’s been discussed first. I’m sure a lot of that has to do with my upbringing. My parents discussed everything together. They also weren’t really into the whole religion thing. Ever really. (as a side note… I ALMOST became a nun. For real.) So, my examination of the bible tells me that what I do for my boyfriend is how I should be doing it. That’s my interpretation.
    • Mel We are very alike. I was in a relationship for 9 years, married for the last 3…he was a non-Christian and did not exhibit any type of leadership besides “you should do what I say.” I did not submit simply because he did not lead…had he led and not just demanded I do what he said, it would have been fine. I did all I could to make that marriage work, in the end he chose to try to cheat…I left. I do not allow anyone to treat me bad, there is no excuse for it. I met D, and we clicked immediately. He was a gift from God. (See ,we are alike) However, I was most ready and able to submit because D leads because he is led. He does not simply sit around telling me to clean and cook him dinner and shut up. He provides guidance and we together provide a happy home. I know happy homes can be achieved in other situations than ours. I feel like I gained back SO MUCH OF ME, because I am free to be me with D…and know I am loved through all of my “me-ness.”  Thank you for your insight! I wish you all the best in your marriage, and encourage you to step a little outside and see if it could be even better with the good man you have now!  Don’t be offended, but I think you have a submissive heart and don’t want to label it as that. There are not any differences in you and me through what you have said, except I admit to agreeing with the verses. I can’t tell you how many times my idea is the one we go with after talking about something. More often than not, D says “you know, you are right, I think this is how we should handle ____.” And it was my idea! We council each other. Submission has nothing to do with him having the “last word.” It’s about how I act/react to him.
    • MM I’m a hell of an enigma. But I LOVE talking about this. It is interesting and I get to learn something about others! 🙂 I think my reactions depend on the person I’m with. And I definitely don’t do labels. Except freaking AWESOME. Just because I am. ;)‎(and it takes a LOT to offend me)
    • Mel Me too! I really don’t see one bit of difference in our relationships or even our backgrounds (I was raised strict Baptist – no pants, no rock music). I think that there are some women, like yourself, who don’t truly “get” the submit and what it means. Or have been through a bad relationship and use that. You can ask anyone to describe me…headstrong and bossy is top of the list. D calls it “forceful opinions.”
    • MM  ROFL… I call it “my way or the highway.”  The only tattoo I have I got when I was 19. It’s a yin yang. It’s suiting for me. It shows balance, equality and that’s how I feel about all of my relationships.
    • Mel So, that is why I say I don’t think people “get it” it’s not about being shy, quiet, meek and mild…it’s about how to treat him and how he treats you. Also, to reference your post about your ex – I said it in the blog, and an old blog…you are not responsible to submit to someone who is devastating you. It is not a commandment to suffer. When you are with a man who looks to God, and loves you so much that he does everything for YOUR good and your betterment…there is no suffering or devastation. As I said, D is here as an extension of God’s love for me, he takes care of me in a human capacity as he is led by God. To me that is just amazing and I don’t get how someone could not want that?

I will say that I feel, after reading again and again (for editing), that my main question was not answered.  I’d love some input and answers from those that feel willing to do so.

My question is: if you are a Christian, and choose NOT to like/believe/live by/adhere to the submission part of your marriage, how do you justify that?  How do you just ignore those verses?  Also, do you feel your husband should love you as he is commanded to, if you do not believe in submission?

I’d love to hear your thoughts!

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This is a second piece, in what I can only assume is going to be an ongoing topic, on my blog.  The first post I did about this was Husbands Love Your Wives (not just a little) and speaks about the Ephesians passage.  I’ve updated this with the third post To submit…or not to Submit.  When I started blogging I didn’t know what I was going to write about, or how often.  I just do it as it comes and it seems that this topic comes up often in my life and those around me.  From Facebook posts to Michelle Bachmann, it seems too many people don’t get it.  So, since you’re here and reading, let’s get going.

I kid with the title, kinda, but it was meant to be funny.  I in no way think or believe God commanded us as wives to submit, no matter what.  So, don’t start with me on the non-Christian husband, the one who doesn’t respect you, the one who doesn’t treat you right and argue that you don’t have to submit because he doesn’t act right.  I’ll cover my thoughts on that (and you probably won’t like them) at the end of this post.

The main reason I love talking about this subject is to testify to how well a home works when it’s run the proper way.  The proper way being when you have a man that looks to God for his leadership, a wife that looks to her husband for leadership and children who know they have parents that love and care for them, and more importantly that love and respect each other.  Yes, this can be achieved sometimes outside of a Christian home, but more often than not, it’s neglected and unattainable in that forum.  I have plenty of friends that don’t get how “submitting” is in their best interest, or that can’t imaging allowing their husband to call the shots.  To that I ask – if you don’t think he’s smart enough or a good enough leader to call the shots why did you marry him?  Seems like a huge lack of good judgement on your part.  I’ve said it before, D has proven more than once before we married that he was quite capable of making good, correct, sensible decisions, and that his ideas were worthy of me agreeing to submit and hand him the last say/control in our relationship.  Ultimately God is the one calling the shots in our marriage, but since there are 3 of us in this boat, there’s got to be a chain of command.

There is more than the Ephesians passage to support the order of the Christian household.  I’m not going to cover the husbands role in full again, because I want to really get into the command the wives receive in these passages.  We see in the following verses that it’s not just one passage, for this post I’ve pulled four that I will discuss and reference all from my favorite translation the King James Version (KJV).  I am going to discuss just the verses with the submit reference, but encourage you to read the rest of the passages because they speak volumes as to WHY you should have a submissive heart/attitude.

Here’s the first one we’ve all heard:

Ephesians 5:22 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. 23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body. 24Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.

33Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.

A second to help remind you:

Colossians 3:18 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as it is fit in the Lord. 19Husbands, love your wives, and be not bitter against them. 20Children, obey your parents in all things: for this is well pleasing unto the Lord. 21Fathers, provoke not your children to anger, lest they be discouraged.

Didn’t like those two?  Let’s try another approach:

Titus 2:3 The aged women likewise, that they be in behaviour as becometh holiness, not false accusers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things; 4That they may teach the young women to be sober, to love their husbands, to love their children, 5To be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed.

Really?  It’s not a suggestion, it’s a direction, stop questioning it already.

1 Peter 3:1 In the same way, you wives, be submissive to your own husbands so that even if any of them are disobedient to the word, they may be won without a word by the behavior of their wives, 2as they observe your chaste and respectful behavior. 3Your adornment must not be merely external—braiding the hair, and wearing gold jewelry, or putting on dresses; 4but let it be the hidden person of the heart, with the imperishable quality of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is precious in the sight of God. 5For in this way in former times the holy women also, who hoped in God, used to adorn themselves, being submissive to their own husbands; 6just as Sarah obeyed Abraham, calling him lord, and you have become her children if you do what is right without being frightened by any fear.

I really don’t know what to say if you don’t like that.  It’s quite clear how we as wives are supposed to act and interact with our husbands, but, let’s look and discuss.

As Christian women we have no issues submitting to the Lord (Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord).  I believe we can all agree to that.  He loves us, listens to our prayers, answers them, chooses not to sometimes, has mercy, shows us He cares and ultimately we feel His presence in our daily lives, what’s not to like here?  We trust in Him.  After years of bad relationships, starting a career, living life, waiting for the “right one” and countless other reasons we should now thank God that we have a good Christian man. I know in my own life God has more than earned the respect and love we are to give Him.  He brought this man to you, He’s given you a partner to be here with you so you can FEEL that love, comfort, caring, burden sharing, leadership, and enjoy life with someone.  Not at all that God feels or thinks He alone isn’t enough, but He knows what we as women need, a partner, a leader, a lover, someone to tend to us and make us happy, God wants us to be HAPPY!  How much is it to ask that you respect, listen to, confer with and submit yourself (head, heart and body) to that man that He chose for you?  Not much I say.

Maybe we should clear up what submission/submitting means.

Submit: verb (used with or without object)

1.to give over or yield to the power or authority of another (often used reflexively).
2.to subject to some kind of treatment or influence.
3.to yield oneself to the power or authority of another: to submit to a conqueror.
4.to allow oneself to be subjected to some kind of treatment: to submit to chemotherapy.
5.to defer to another’s judgment, opinion, decision, etc.: I submit to your superior judgment.

Submission is not once described as mindless following, doing whatever you’re told, having no say, having no voice.  None of the definitions even remotely sound like most of the arguments I’ve heard against submission.  It’s simply what we as humans have wrongly come to interpret this one word to mean.  In God’s plan, submission is simply about giving yourself, as a willing partner to the man He chose to place above you in the chain of command of your home.  Just as there are bosses and employees, too many cooks in the kitchen, too many chiefs and not enough Indians – there has to be order.  If you’re trying to call the shots and your husband is trying to do his God assigned duty and call the shots, things aren’t going to be cohesive.

Wrong...try again.

So far there has only been once that I felt strongly that D was acting against how he should or acting in an unloving way.  I won’t get into incriminating myself specifics, but I may have played a part in his reaction…or not.  Truthfully, it was a mixture of me feeling that he was not holding up his end of the bargain and him feeling that I was undermining/disrespecting him in my reaction to that.  We were both wrong, and still he would argue that I was the cause, and I would point out that he “did” the deed in question for me to react inappropriately.  Which brings me to my point here, if he decides to act in an unloving way that doesn’t afford me the right to do the same and throw God’s plan out the window.  The opposite is true.  I am not free to tell him off, or take over, jump ahead in line, or treat him any differently than God has told me to just because he has forgotten his duty to me.  I CAN speak lovingly and inform him that I disagree with how he is treating me, or how he is talking, and that I believe he is going against the plan.

Barnes states this on the matter:

(4) if she is constrained, however, to differ from him, it should be with mildness and gentleness. There should be no reproach, and no contention. She should simply state her reasons, and leave the event to God.

In other words, if I disagree with D (because he is being mean, or rude, or not leading in a Godly manner), I have a backup plan.  God.  Since D has someone to answer to also, if I disagree or don’t like something I am more than free to pray and ask God for His guidance.  I don’t know how much more absolute you can get when looking for the correct answer.  The bottom line is that if D isn’t cutting it for me, he better hope he’s acting right because he answers to someone way more powerful than he or I am in our relationship.  I do have backup!  There are clear limits and rules over the husband and a huge responsibility on him to lead with my best interest at heart.  If he doesn’t, he’s going to have some ‘splaining to do.

In the beginning I said I would address the women who question the absoluteness of the plan.  I do not condone or think anyone should stay with an abusive man, or with a man who does not wish to live in alignment with God or the Bible.  I think there is always a limit to what one should put up with in any relationship, friendship, family dynamic etc.  You allow people to treat you bad…or you don’t.  If it’s not changing, and if someone is not trying or does not wish to learn how to be in a relationship/marriage the right way, then I believe it’s time to seriously re-evaluate whether you need to be there or not.  However, if you choose to stay there, then yes, you should still act in submission – see the following verse (again).

1 Peter 3:1 In the same way, you wives, be submissive to your own husbands so that even if any of them are disobedient to the word, they may be won without a word by the behavior of their wives, 2as they observe your chaste and respectful behavior.

All Christian women know, and even non-Christian women can see clearly that men, tall-short-big-little-loving-happy-unloving-sad-Christian-working-non-Christian-unemployed men, all beam with pride when they know they have earned the approval and have pleased a woman.  Do you want your man to do something more than once…thank him and praise him the first time he does it.  The look on a man’s face when a woman is proud of him, when she supports him, when she looks to him, listens to him, asks him his opinion, listens to his words, praises his decisions, loves him, respects him, wants him to be a good man, and brags to those around her about how wonderful a provider and partner he is…that look, that pride he feels, is no mistake in God’s plan.  A man that feels the love and respect of his wife can and will do anything to make her happy, to keep seeing that reaction and feeling that emotion.  There is no quicker way to defeat a man than to let him know you are disappointed in him or that you don’t think he is worthy of your respect and worthy to lead you or your family.  If you are looking for the queen treatment there is also no better way to get loved and protected, and to be lifted up as wives should be according to God’s plan, than by submitting to your husband.

I’ll leave you with another wife’s interpretation of what submission means in her marriage.  I think she is dead on also.

I am in full agreement with Barnes and his interpretation on the Ephesians passage.  I may continue with more on his notes, but I think we’ve learned enough for today…get to submittin’!

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